Pregnant patients should feel empowered to have a birth experience that reflects their culture and values. Regions Hospital Family Birth Center was created with that focus – as a place for family-centered care, high reliability and health equity. LeeAnn Hubbard, MD, the birth center’s medical director, discusses how health equity is the foundation of the facility, its importance in the delivery experience, and the partnership between providers and families.
Pregnant patients should feel empowered to have a birth experience that reflects their culture and values. Regions Hospital Family Birth Center was created with that focus – as a place for family-centered care, high reliability and health equity.
LeeAnn Hubbard, MD, the birth center’s medical director, discusses how health equity is the foundation of the facility, its importance in the delivery experience, and the partnership between providers and families.
Hosts: Kari Haley, MD, and Steven Jackson, MD
Guest: LeeAnn Hubbard, MD
HealthPartners website: Off the Charts podcast
Got an idea? Have thoughts to share? We want to hear from you. Email us at offthecharts@healthpartners.com.
Kari Haley:
Just as a preface for this episode, we do have conversations surrounding birth, but also talking about infant loss, infertility, miscarriages. So if any of those topics hit you a little too close to home or too sensitive, this may be an episode to skip.
Kari Haley:
He's a rehab doctor from Chicago.
Steven Jackson:
She's an emergency medicine doctor from the Twin Cities.
Kari Haley:
Together, we're examining the health equity emergency.
Steven Jackson:
Inviting voices for change without the cue cards.
Kari Haley:
I'm Dr. Kari Haley.
Steven Jackson:
I'm Dr. Steven Jackson.
Both, together:
And this is Off the Charts.
Kari Haley:
Today, we are talking with Dr. LeeAnn Hubbard, who is the medical director of the Regions Hospital Family Birth Center. Welcome to the show.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Thank you. Thank you guys for having me.
Steven Jackson:
We're really excited about this conversation that we are about to have, because we have so many questions and maybe some stories to share as well in this space. So getting right into it, what inspired you to not only go into medicine, but go into OB-GYN?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
It's a good question. I always thought I wanted to be a doctor in part because my grandfather was. And he was very much the pediatrician of the forties, fifties, sixties with an office in his house, home visits, all of that. That was what I was exposed to growing up. But then when I went to medical school, I found out, it was a surprise to me, I actually liked the OR and I liked procedures. I don't know why I wasn't expecting to. It caught me off guard. I thought I would go the primary care peds route, like my grandpa, but then I really liked OB-GYN because it had some of that procedural field, but even more so I just found pregnancy so fascinating. And also that you get to know people over time, like a primary care doctor, but just from a different point of view and such big parts of their life as well. And I found it's been a really good fit.
Steven Jackson:
OK. So where are you from originally?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
I actually grew up in the south metro here in town, Minnesota Midwesterner, went all the way to Iowa for college, but then came back here for med school and training.
Steven Jackson:
So Midwest is in the blood basically.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Yeah, exactly.
Steven Jackson:
OK. All right.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Yeah.
Steven Jackson:
OK. It sounds good.
Kari Haley:
Based on some of your training that you've had here in the Twin Cities area with OB-GYN, did you have exposure even before you became you in here to the equity differences that we have seen and that we all acknowledge that have, especially when it comes to moms and babies?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
I definitely think so. And as much as, I don't know, over time, how many times I was intentionally thinking about it that way, it would become apparent at times in just different hospital settings, whether it's the university versus community and just access issues and the things that you read about being true, just the trust level and delays in care and those barriers that have been brought to light as they should have, much more in the last few years. But I do think it's been there for a long time.
Steven Jackson:
I'm imagining when you went into your field of practice, I guess it's still a field of study, because I guess we're always studying and practicing, but I would imagine going into OB, maybe health equity wasn't at the top of the list only because maybe it just wasn't, I don't know, I wouldn't say as important, but maybe it wasn't as prevalent and maybe it wasn't presented as much of a need as it is today. And I'm just wondering, where did the transition and how did the transition occur where health equity for you personally, was important and now I have to be a part of it and do something about it?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Absolutely. And I do think that's true that over time I've always felt that pregnancy and birth, especially as within the wide spectrum of things that you do on a given day, it's not just an exciting part of life, but a very vulnerable part of life for every patient. And it can be the best day of someone's life or the worst. We have a lot of high highs and low lows on labor and delivery. So I always felt that over time. But then I think as time has gone on and say, I've been out of residency for about 13 years.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
After those first year or two, when being a new attending is out of your system and you're getting into more of a groove and you can step back a little bit more and look with a wider perspective at what you're doing every day and not just the nuts and bolts of it. That mindset for me started happening, I think at the same time that more of a national conversation was starting and just bringing to light putting numbers and data and discussion around the disparities that the U.S. Has in birth outcomes compared to other countries of our same resource level. And so I think that just aligned really well.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
And then at the same time, about four years ago, when I stepped into more of a leadership role in our department, it was great timing to really just put an emphasis around that, especially at a hospital like ours at Regions which, one of the most fantastic parts about it is we see people from all over the world, all walks of life. And that was really something that drew me to want to work here in the first place.
Kari Haley:
You mentioned trust and we trust, we talk about trust so much on this podcast, but I think it's interesting because I have three kiddos. So I've been through pregnancy, I've been through birth three times here. That trust piece I feel like is just so much more amplified when you're dealing with a pregnant population because not only are you worried about yourself and your own health, but then you are caring for the health of a being to be. It's so much more that trust can be broken so much easier, or it has to be earned that much more difficult. It's that much more difficult to earn it. What have your experience been through the years here, especially now that the big focus on really building that trust of methods of what have we done wrong in the past that has broken that trust that has inhibited the trust build to now making that transition to, we actively are trying to seek out more trust our patients?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Good question. I think several different levels of, over time, what ... And it's this intent versus impact. I don't know that it was an intended thing, but the impact was huge where you're as a practice, we hadn't really been reaching out to the communities that are the biggest communities that are our patients and listening. We hadn't been making things that seem as basic as the scheduling of your first prenatal visit, easy.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
We hadn't been doing as much outreach in terms of "what do you do when you think you're pregnant?" Or "what do you do as a young girl who maybe doesn't want to be pregnant and wants to even just talk about birth control?" Just opening those layers of communication, and then knowing too that whether it's things that had happened to friends or family members of our patients. I don't think that we ... And I mean that we, Regions, but we as the obstetric community too, just hadn't owned that that happened, and just been upfront saying, "We know this has not been right, and we want to be a part of that solution. And just being open about that too." Which is not necessarily really easy to do, but the most important part about it.
Steven Jackson:
So we have a lot of listeners and many are on maybe different parts of the journey when it comes to understanding the importance of health equity and how bias and race and culture and gender and a lot of these things play a role, an important role in how care is received, how care is deliberate, et cetera, so on and so forth. And I want you to speak to the listener that's sitting here saying, "Why is this important? Why do we even have an episode about this?" Why is this important, LeeAnn?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
I think it's important on so many levels from individual all the way to public health, which has been in the forefront of all of our minds. So much more in the pandemic, but the most important thing I think for whether they're a physician or a nurse or any health care provider who is listening to this thinking, why should I think this is important? It's ultimately the foundation of why we all went into this. First do no harm. And I think you can't have a true therapeutic relationship with a patient unless you have trust at the foundation of it because patients as they should, they assume we have the medical knowledge and the procedural skills, but then is more than that to actually fully and holistically take care of someone. And I'm not saying that as myself saying, "I've got this nailed personally." But that's such a foundation of just the heart of everything in health care.
Steven Jackson:
Yeah. I think about trust and like Kari said, we talk about trust even if we don't intend to talk about trust, it comes up.
Kari Haley:
It always does.
Steven Jackson:
Because, as you've already said, it's fundamental to what we do in health care. It's fundamental to what occurs in education. It's fundamental in so many different walks of life. Just something so basic yet so important and so impactful. Interestingly enough, you said something that struck a chord, you said, "Yeah, we're physicians and a lot of our patients assume that we're competent because of what we do." But competency doesn't always equate to trust, because you can be as competent as you want to be. But I don't trust you because I don't feel you care about me as a person. You care about me as a diagnosis or a case to be presented at more on a report. Have you had any experiences, putting you on a spot, where you feel like "Man, I blew it. I could have done that differently, and now I have to build that trust back." Have you had any experiences like that?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
It's a good question. You can always reflect on whether it's just one conversation or a series of clinic visits that you just don't feel went well or you don't have the connection that you want, or I think about that a lot too, because our patients, even during COVID and obviously beforehand too, it's a family affair having a baby and birth. And so we're trying to establish open lines of communication and rapport and trust with the patient's most trusted people as well.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
So I can think of times that I don't think it went as smoothly as possible. And I do think over time, and in part probably more so in the last few years with even the additional, just being really intentional in the conversations and even the different trainings and talks and things that we've gone to, I think I've become more comfortable saying to the patient, "I don't think this went well, am I feeling that right? Tell me, educate me."
Steven Jackson:
That's pretty powerful.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Like, "We're not on the same wavelength and let's explore it." And maybe I may be totally off base, but I think that's one of the really powerful, cool, intimidating, lots of different ways to describe it, but especially on labor and delivery, because it's such an intense unit.
Kari Haley:
Yeah.
Steven Jackson:
Absolutely.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
That you have to be a little bit more comfortable with intense conversations.
Kari Haley:
Yeah. You're having to make decisions for moms and their babies in a moment where they may not be able to ... Even if they are very well versed in medicine or have had two or three babies before, like everything is unique, everything is different in your world. So having that line of trust is really important.
Kari Haley:
Just as a personal story, it's interesting thinking about that. I actually had my first kid when I was in medical school. So I was a pregnant second year medical student and went to a OB-GYN at the hospital that I was associated with the medical school. And interestingly enough, I ended up just not liking her. It was that, we didn't click, I don't know, we didn't communicate well, and I ended up having a resident be my OB for my pregnancy, which was great. She was great, we had a good relationship. And then at the end of pregnancy, so during the birth process, it was, again interesting. And it was the same staff who happened to be there for the birth. She was the one on call.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Of course.
Kari Haley:
A different resident was there, but ended up ... Long story short is, I had an epidural. I was a first time mom, I know the medical thing of being like, those babies won't come very fast necessarily, like they'll push for a while, but my infant ended up being born into the bed and the nurse had to catch him because I don't know if I was not believed when I said, "I'm not pushing, but there is an infant coming, birth is coming." And I think about that now as a physician and thinking about how for me, that layer of trust was just gone. It was just an eye-opening thing for that experience.
Kari Haley:
But I can only imagine now as a physician, having seen other patients and communities where we don't speak the same language, communities where we don't have the same cultural practices of during this extremely vulnerable period of birth, how we treat them and how we communicate with them is so incredibly important. So I'd love for you to maybe talk a little bit about what Regions or what you have done with the birth center with this brand-new facility to really promote that, because I think that's so important.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Absolutely. I think in OB also, there's so much and really it shouldn't be this way and it's something as a profession we all need to work on too, that people need to be practiced seeing the same evidence based medicine. Because I know patients will come from other places too and say, "I had a C-section, but I don't really remember why they just said I needed to." And it's like, we need to have shared decision making here.
Kari Haley:
Yes.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
And then adding in the family and cultural and just life experience aspect. And we wanted to be really open when we were building the new building to say, "this is Regions' new birth center," but this is also, the patients that are going to come here, it's their space as well, and we want them to be informing a lot of that. And so we did partner with several community groups here in St. Paul to do even some focus groups. And it was really interesting and fun to get to meet more people in town.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
We had worked with Everyday Miracles, which is a group in town that does prenatal classes and offers doula support programs. And the reason that we worked them is they actually offer their classes in multiple different languages and they offer a sliding scale for pay and actually offer some insurance coverage through theirs, which is not very common for birth classes or doulas.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
So they have been a great resource. And then we've also partnered with a group in town and it's abbreviated, D.I.V.A. Moms. That's dedicated to helping our Black patients just navigate pregnancy and seeing what they need from us. Meeting people where they're at. And that group is so impressive and has grown so much even, in the last few years, I feel like that's such a valuable connection for our own learning. And then also the Hmong Medical Professionals Coalition in town has been a really great connection. And those groups particular, we met with several patient groups even to ask questions like, what colors do people want these days? Especially, too, thinking there's a generational piece too, because a lot of our patients are in their 20s, 30s, younger than me. And so there was even some eye-opening things that seemed to be cross-cultural like people wanted the wall behind the birthing bed to be a nice, plain color because it's the selfie wall. Like, talk about a sign of the times.
Kari Haley:
Wow.
Steven Jackson:
Wow.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
So we actually had a lot of conversations about the selfie wall on top of, can we offer different diets? Can we offer, for example, in the Hmong religion, the new mom has to eat very specific diet for the first 30 days after delivery. And so we worked with our nutritional services who was fantastic to say, "Yes, let's honor that, let's meet with the community to see what do they need."
Kari Haley:
That's great.
Steven Jackson:
That's awesome.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
So that's just one example that I think has been so simple actually to implement, which sounds funny to say, because I thought, "Oh, we should have done this 10 years ago." So that kind of thing we took into account.
Kari Haley:
I think that's so awesome. I think that as physicians, sometimes we get caught into our little boxes of, "Our society says, 'This is when we should do this visit' or 'this is when we should do this procedure' or 'this is when it's important to have this conversation.' " But that doesn't take the patient into account at all. So these little steps in these things that are fairly simple when you really get down to it makes such a huge difference because you're actually treating your patient and what they desire and what their culture is. I just think it's awesome.
Steven Jackson:
Yeah. I'm speechless at a lot of the work that went into the planning and just the forward thinking and not only forward thinking, but just taking into account the patient center and the family centered approach to this. I often say sometimes out loud that a lot of times the processes that we design are for us as physicians, because it makes us more efficient and makes our days go faster or better. And sometimes I think there are times that we do that and the patients are thought about second.
Steven Jackson:
And I think this is an example of how ... Well, they were definitely first. A selfie wall; that's cool. I don't take a lot of selfies, and I'll honestly just really keeping up with, "Well, what is going on?" and what that says to me is, "Well, I care about my patients and their families as people, not just as patients, not just as a person who is about to deliver, but what's important to you, what's meaningful to you." It's called, I see you, I hear you, and I support you as a person. I just think that goes a long way, especially when we think about building trust.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Absolutely. And we as an outward statement of that and a level setting even for ourselves within our department, we, through the birth center building project, and we've continued this since ... We have three pillars that we are always centering on things very much equally weighted in health equity, family centered care and high reliability, certainly keeping safety as a part of that. But that the patient centered piece is forefront because it ties into everything.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
And we've tried as well to start getting ahead of ... Even when we're writing policies or doing the things that we know we need to do for our day to day work, even having that equity lens, having that patient and family centered lens, we've started trying to also change some of our language and our policy documents around gendered language and that kind of thing. Just again, trying to just be open, be welcoming, be learning all the time too. Not only just seeing how the department and our staff has been transitioning, but tying it in with the new birth center and that building project, that was just a fascinating thing to be involved in just the scale of it. And not even when we down to like the selfie wall conversations, but even talking with the city about, "we can't go too close to [Interstate] 35E because of this on one level," but then getting down to, "OK, how are the patients going to enter the building and what are they going to feel when they see ... What's the initial welcome from all those levels?" It was a fascinating project.
Kari Haley:
Just to have that ground up, being able to be a part of the whole process. Well, it just sparked a thought here too is because I know from working in ED that you have a lot of trainees too, that come through. So you have medical students and you have residents who come through here, what pieces do you hope that they take away from their experience with the Regions Birth Center?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Yeah, I hope that they would say this and that we're instilling some of the same point of view in them. And I really think the University of Minnesota is also doing a really good job with how they are I was going to say raising the med students. That's not their right phrase. In terms of, I think they are actually including much more standard, not only just conversation and acknowledgement, but implicit bias training and things. But I know our residency program does, which I think is tremendous again, while we might be a little ahead of the curve in where we're at here at Regions, it's a universal priority or should be for everyone.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
And so we have a lot of conversations with the residents, even at morning sign out or morning safety rounds, just level setting, not only what is the patient's next step in the plan of the day is, but are there any other needs that that family has brought up or are there any other considerations from just either the equity family centered, both keeping that lens in really all the decision making too.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
And I'd like to think I should ask them actually with us being intentional about that. I hope that it is getting gears turning, especially because while a lot of them do stay in Minnesota, they're far flung, and hopefully they can take that to their units.
Kari Haley:
Yeah. I think just building that culture and building a new generation that can continue the culture do better on that culture is something huge, it's something that I really hope that with our podcast also is something that we're building some knowledge, building a culture of people who listen, who then maybe have their own ideas and can bring them forward out into the world and just continue down the path where, hopefully it brings more equity and brings more kindness and that lens to the world.
Steven Jackson:
Well, it's story time.
Kari Haley:
This is Dr. Jackson's story time.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
All right.
Steven Jackson:
And I have several accounts of this occurring, but it's pretty often when we were having kids, we're now raising them and sending them to college. But there were occasions where I felt ignored, the physician would only look at my wife and only talk to my wife and I'm sitting there like, "Hi, I'm the dad." And I might be neither be here nor there, but they would ask "And who are you again? Or who might you be?" I'm like, "Well, I'm not the baby's daddy, I'm the husband." It's an example. But the point I'm trying to make is, I felt pretty uncomfortable in a lot of situations in going to the doctor with my wife, for OB appointments, because I felt like I was an outsider looking in and I didn't feel included in the process. Just wondering, is that something that occurs and what has been your experience with something like that?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
It's a good question. I do think it occurs. I hate to say it, but I think what you're saying is probably an experience that a lot of expecting fathers might say, unfortunately, especially maybe five, 10-plus years ago as the tide is appropriately turning to this, this is a family event, not just the birthing person. I think in our practice, what we try to do to stray from that path is really try to get to know the father, the key support people by name, the partner. We try to have that in the chart and there's a sticky note thing that comes to your eyes and some important things about that family. Then we'll often say, "What does the partner do? Or do they know if they're expecting a boy or girl? Are there any specific things like fun stuff too, that they brought up that we can have that in people's forefront to try to make a connection in that sense."
LeeAnn Hubbard:
And in the hospital, what we try to do, and we've actually tried to get some patient feedback on this. And I think it's been pretty positive. We actually, on the care boards, in the patient's rooms, in the birth center, that was another place that we tried to get community feedback on, "What do you want it to say? We got to write things on there.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Like, PT [physical therapy] coming at 3 o'clock, but what do the patients want to communicate and how to phrase that with who their support people are? Who are with them? And we have something on there that says, "Questions for the day." Which I think is pretty standard on many care boards, but there's another section that's, I don't remember the exact reason, that's like, "Your priorities are your .... We wanted to bring some emphasis like that too. Hopefully in part to not make fathers and other significant people in the patient's life feel like they're outside of the bubble, in that sense? I'd like to think we're doing a better job at it.
Steven Jackson:
I guess I'm speaking up for all the dads out there, "Hang in there, Dad." Yeah. It's a very important process obviously for mom and baby, but for dad as well, because I did feel excluded and it was fine. And at the end of the day, one thing, I never tell people what I do when I go to doctor's appointments with my kids, I never do that because I don't want to wave the big MD shield around. So everybody gets nervous and they treat you differently. Then I want people to do what they're best at without any distraction. And, again, at the end of the day, I appreciate what you guys do. I couldn't even imagine bringing life into the world. I would be a nervous wreck, I'll stick to rehab for now.
Kari Haley:
Yeah. If you ask pretty much any, ER, doctor they'll be like our worst imaginable thing is birthing children in the ER. So our hats are definitely off to our OB-GYN colleagues.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Well, we highly appreciate both of you, isn't it? It's so interesting. Things are getting so specialized lately. It's like, I can't even think about doing X, Y, Z, but then when you do it all the time, it's not special, but it is a little more like, "OK. Yeah, I don't get too nervous." But I feel like even, because I have two kids also, and I think my husband felt that way, too.
Steven Jackson:
It's a thing.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
There's abbreviation that doesn't get used as much anymore, but FOB, father of baby.
Steven Jackson:
Oh, wow.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Like, "Who's the FOB's name so we can know?" And I remember my husband being like, "I'm an FOB." I'm like, "Oh, boy."
Steven Jackson:
Sounds like a swear word. Are you FOB?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Too many acronyms in OB, and there's one of them, I think.
Kari Haley:
Well, to talk a little bit more about some things your profession, OB-GYN, and particularly thinking about the OB piece of things, is not always happy stories. There are, I think the stats say like one in four women have a miscarriage or a stillbirth, or the experience of infertility is another large piece of the journey that women and families go through. Can you talk a little bit about how you serve your patients who are going through these really hard, really honestly devastating times?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Absolutely. It's the part of OB that the people don't like to think about, but is so true and is more common than any of us would like. And I was thinking about this when Steven, when you were sharing your experience of being the dad in the room and feeling outside of the bubble, that, if I put a huge amount of value in the fact that if you don't have a trust level and a rapport with the patient and their family, that, if this is a super uncomplicated delivery, everything goes well, it won't be as obvious or it won't be as big of a deal, but it's so much more important to take good care of patients and families when they're going through a tragedy. And it brings back even more of a priority to the fact that ... Really acknowledging that and being intentional, that if you don't have that trust that we were talking about is at the foundational level, that's just going to add to that patient's tragedy and add to more difficulty with their recovery and waiting through the grief process.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
And I always think it's much more important in a way that we execute at a high, high level when patients are going through a really bad outcome. Not that you don't want to for good outcomes, too, but just when people are having that worst day, that's where things really ... Any gaps come, yeah, so much to the forefront.
Kari Haley:
Yes.
Steven Jackson:
Yeah. That's again, trust exceedingly important, even through the trying and tragic times because if trust isn't there, I can imagine a patient, I can imagine a family feeling alone because here's this physician team that you didn't really build that trust with, and now you have to lean on yourself and hopefully family's involved, but those that you would like to lean on the care staff, the physicians that know about this, even from the medical professional standpoint, well that relationship isn't there. And so all the more, building that early and being intentional about that is just important because LeeAnn you already said, in OB, you see the best days of people lives and you see the worst days.
Steven Jackson:
What should our listeners walk away remembering from our conversation today? Because we talked about a lot and obviously you guys are doing great work and we are exceedingly grateful, from physician to physician, from dad and parent to mom, excuse me. What should we walk away with today?
LeeAnn Hubbard:
I would say, I'd love for people to know that not only do we see health equity in our role in, because we can't repair what's happened in the past, but acknowledging and just frankly, doing better moving forward. We have a big intentionality around that, a big priority on that, but knowing that we do not have it figured out just because we are part of that bigger conversation. And so really just want to keep hearing from patients and from the community, what are we doing, right. What are we not doing right. And what can we keep doing to continue to improve and thereby too, how can we influence the rest of our medical community, especially and at more of a national level, as part of some of the things that I'm also involved in with, ACOG or American College of OB-GYN I think, they definitely acknowledge this, too.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
And various parts of the country are also less and more involved. I think the Midwest tends to be ... Maybe we're just "Minnesota nice" people. We want to do better when we see an issue. But for patients to know too, that nationally, it is something that the U.S. In general that as obstetricians, we want to improve, but 100% here at Regions, that is our big priority. And we just so value people walking with us during that and to trusting us and coming, not only to our beautiful new building, but to meet our amazing staff and again letting us know what we're doing well and what we can improve on.
Kari Haley:
Thinking back on some of our previous episodes talking about the cultural humility piece of things and just bringing that gap between the provider and the patient closer together. And really this is a journey that we're both taking, that we're both on, we'll help guide you through the medical things, but how can we help you keep the things that are important to you important? And I think that's just something that we can all try doing both in our medical practice and in our personal lives, just as human to human and being 100%.
Steven Jackson:
Absolutely.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Absolutely.
Steven Jackson:
Well, again, we thank you so much for being a guest today. Thank you for prioritizing not only health equity, but patient experience and just taking care of our moms and babies.
Kari Haley:
And dads.
Steven Jackson:
And dads, too.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
And dads and family. No, absolutely. Thank you for inviting me. I'm just so proud of our hospital and our work and just so thankful to be a part of it.
Steven Jackson:
Well, I guess we'll see you in the hallway sometime.
LeeAnn Hubbard:
Sounds good.
Steven Jackson:
Off the Charts is a production of HealthPartners and Park Nicollet.
Kari Haley:
It is recorded by Jimmy Bellamy with creative by Peggy Arnson, Tina Long, Tim Myers and Jeff Jondahl.
Steven Jackson:
Production services provided by Matriarch Digital Media.
Kari Haley:
Our theme music is by Ryan Ike.